The greatest?
It's a brief discussion, but Grift is arguing that Hank Aaron is the greatest baseball player of all time and I, while being a big fan of Hammerin' Hank, think he's overstating that.
My top five?
In no particular order ...
Babe Ruth
Willie Mays
Ted Williams
Ty Cobb
Pete Rose
My top five?
In no particular order ...
Babe Ruth
Willie Mays
Ted Williams
Ty Cobb
Pete Rose
posted by Jmac at 5:46 PM
17 Comments:
Mine, for giggles, are in order (non-pitchers):
1. Ruth
2. Williams
3. Mays
4. Aaron
5. Cobb
And let's go to ten just to add some names.
6. Rogers Hornsby
7. Lou Gehrig
8. Stan Musial
9. Joe DiMaggio
10. Rose
Bonds and A-Rod will be on the list by the time they're finished.
I can't count any player who played before 1947.
Imagine the game without blacks and hispanics (and now Asians). That's the game Ruth and Cobb and Gehrig played. Half the field was missing. (Hell, I don't have to imagine the game without blacks and hispanics and Asians; I can go to a college game and see it first hand. And college baseball sucks).
My top 5:
1) Aaron
2) Mays
3) Frank Robinson
4) Ted Williams
5) A-Rod
Anon-by that logic, you can't evaluate a lot of satchel paige's career.
sorry but it doesn't hold up.
Ruth was a great player. Period.
The only reason Ted Williams doesn't dominate all offensive statistics is because he was called to active duty in the military twice, giving up substantial parts of his career. The second time (Korean War) he was at his peak. He lost five years to serving his country.
His .400 batting average is so incredible and unattainable, it is hardly mentioned as a goal.
I don't evaluate a lot of Satchel Paige's stats, but I do know that when played against Ruth, et al, in those barnstorming games he did very well.
Ruth might've been great in today's game, but then again he'd have to contend with Tori Hunter climbing fences to retrieve his home runs. He might've faced Lee Smith a few times, or Mariano Rivera, or Bob Gibson or Dontrelle Willis or any of the other great minority pitchers he didn't have to face in the White Bread Leagues.
How many consecutive games you think Joe Dimaggio hits in if Ozzie Smith is playing short?
Take the minorities out, and it's a game I can't take seriously, no matter how hallowed the names in it.
And don't forget Josh Gibson. He's the one most overlooked from the Negro Leagues, and one could make a very compelling argument he was the most complete player of all time.
stopthebs, I waffled a hundred times about who's number-one between Ruth and Williams. I finally punked out and gave it to Ruth with cultural impact as the tie-breaker...but I do think Ted Williams was the best hitter to ever pick up a bat. There's a reason they're still selling "The Science of Hitting."
How many home runs would B. Bonds have hit (assuming no body altering substances were involved), or even Hammering Hank, with a dead ball, 154 game season, no air travel, eight teams so you didn't have diluted pitching, and a true doubleheader every week or so.
I guess we chunk all of the college records too, pre-integration. No bowl wins, no won-loss records, no conference championships.
Babe didn't hit many dead-ball homers, either. And he never played a major league game west of the Mississippi, or south of Washington.
And yes, if we're going to take the game seriously, it's hard to argue that Red Grange would be able to carry Emmitt Smith's jockstrap.
Red didn't run against the best athletes; Emmitt did.
And Red didn't have an average 300 pound hall of fame line in front of him either.
it's hard to argue that Red Grange would be able to carry Emmitt Smith's jockstrap.
Well, I'm certainly not arguing it; why would he want to?
I guess Jim Thorpe's records don't count either.
And he never played a major league game west of the Mississippi,
BTW, that is incorrect.
Well, OK, but only barely: I forgot about the St Louis Browns. Anybody else?
Anybody else?
St. Louis Cardinals
Cardinals were in the NL.
Unless they met in a World Series...(which maybe they did; I'm too lazy to look it up).
Cardinals were in the NL.
Indeed they are.
Yankees v. Cards, 1929 World Series, Yankees in 4.
Right, Babe Ruth played several years in the dead ball era (and as a pitcher, to boot!). Yet, despite that, the man hit over 700 home runs. He "lost" about 6 seasons of genuine home run hitting potential off his career, yet still got to 715. I think that makes the pro-Ruth argument stronger.
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